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Post by Tasneem on Dec 4, 2005 19:15:57 GMT -6
HAH, that anology of the EU and Turkey was just great...
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Post by Brian Capelle on Dec 4, 2005 19:58:10 GMT -6
Aryeztur,
If you can show me that Herr is still an Aryezi, is still active, and shares at LEAST about the same amount of power with you in Aryez, certainly enough to prevent any declarations of war, transfers of power, or other rash actions, I will stop fussing and welcome you completely!
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Post by Aryeztur on Dec 4, 2005 20:19:49 GMT -6
Well the Premier of Aryez is currently Shahdev.
Anyhow, read the constitution. I don't have the power to declare war or really determine its policies.
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Post by Brian Capelle on Dec 4, 2005 20:28:20 GMT -6
Ok, I will, tomorrow maybe.
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Post by Nathan on Dec 4, 2005 21:54:20 GMT -6
actually... brian is right. Aryez really hasnt "founded" the UC.... its been all just Sullifree and Natopia... Alrodria should also get founding status coz he offered to join up very shortly after we began the talks.
i vote we vote Aryez in after the UC has been established.
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Post by Aryeztur on Dec 5, 2005 15:50:02 GMT -6
How about you put in Aryez now, but exculde it from being listed as a founding member in the charter.
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Post by raulmarrio2000 on Dec 5, 2005 17:05:03 GMT -6
Just a question, are the nations signing this document going to be still IA members. According to our Laws they can. But Aryez has not yet appointed its Senator. I beg all nations and their authorities, that in case a IA member does not wish to remain in the IA, please let us know in our forum formally. Respectfully Raul Lavin PM of the IA association.12.forumer.com
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Post by Brian Capelle on Dec 5, 2005 18:16:51 GMT -6
Sullifree definately will remain a member, Natopia will probably remain a non-member (if you remember they left) and Aldrodria... I dunno. I didn't even know Aryez was an IA member. I can assure you, the UC really has nothing to do with the idea, I don't think even under the belief that the IA was gone that the idea Z had of naming hte UC the IA was very smart.
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Post by Aryeztur on Dec 5, 2005 18:18:26 GMT -6
I didn't know Aryez was an IA member either. I had applied for IA membership a long time ago and never recieved a reply because it was around the time that their forums got deleted.
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Post by Brian Capelle on Dec 5, 2005 18:36:43 GMT -6
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Post by Brian Capelle on Dec 5, 2005 20:15:16 GMT -6
REMAINING PROBLEMS
-can the UC kick out a member -the opt-out regarding war -recognition of new governments after revolutions (consider one end of the spectrum with Lavalon post-Kieran, and the other with Antica, with many now siding with the Republic, amazingly!) -whether to admit aryez now, as an observing member, or wait until UC is created -NEEM: "And well, what will happen if Natopia decides to go back to a monarchy or something of the sort?" BRIAN: "Nothing wrong with that, I mean violent... peaceful revolutions are ok"
ARYEZTUR: "How about you put in Aryez now, but exculde it from being listed as a founding member in the charter."
Good idea---perhaps we can go ahead and admit Aryez but not require their approval to set up the UC.
Also, make sure that the UC does not necessarily automatically disband if one of the founding members left,
and again, what about inter-member relations?
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Post by Nathan on Dec 5, 2005 20:29:20 GMT -6
what, exactly IS war in micronationalism if not recwar?
i support an opt-out for war that is worded such like "the member nation supports its fellow UC members in this war, but cannot engage in 'war' due to internal circumstances
i dunno about revolutions...
i want aryez the first nation admitted to the UC by capital act.
what about inter-member relations? the courts settle inter-member relations. members are responsible for their own foreign policy as well. perhaps a clause is needed saying that all members must have recognition treaties at least.
also... i thought about it.. and ive decided again that i dont want the united court being able to overturn Natopia's high court's rulings.
how could the UC disband if a founding member leaves?
where does it suggest in there that their leaving will affect the UC? it just says "once theyve ratifed the document" and thats all its concerned about, it could care less if founder leaves... it already got its ratification. ~1/2 the original 13 colonies left the union and congress didnt sit around and go "oh shit... do we have to disband now?"
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Post by Tasneem on Dec 5, 2005 20:39:13 GMT -6
So, if one gets out, the whole thing won't collapse, like VAUS, right?
I think we need to have a clause that if the gov't changes radically and there's a problem, then measures can be taken to remove the country or at least formally give them a notice about it. You don't have to act if they change, but if it's a problem then something can be done.
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Post by Brian Capelle on Dec 5, 2005 20:45:18 GMT -6
Forum bombs... hacks... real stuff. Rec-war I think should be left to members.
And the idea of the UC declaring war is that it uses its own forces, I never meant each nation would have to lend a hand or anything.
I want the court to be able to overturn rulings should it come to that, if you would like to figure out another check on that that's fine.
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Post by Nathan on Dec 5, 2005 20:51:19 GMT -6
i just dont like the idea of the UC being able to have a "stamp of approval" for any sort of government changes...
no one uses forum bombs anymore (except delphi) becuase they know they will get way too much flak from everyone else for doing it. forum hacks are like nukes in real life... they are useless because as soon as u use one on someone, they will use it on u and if "victory" to you means ur both dead or both forums are wiped... well... huzzah.
the UC wont have its own forces if members maintain control of their militaries... its almost like how the UN keeps its peacekeepers... members donate.
i will not have a possible non-Natopian interpreting Natopian laws for Natopia is basically what it boils down to. so perhaps the court should just be abolished and the House of Sovereigns can be the judicial thing...
im seriously doubting we'll have enough people to fill all these spots in the bureacracy anyway...
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